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Topic 22 of 96: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy

Mon, Nov 9, 1998 (17:49) | Paul Terry Walhus (terry)



Late last week, with no open debate at all, a joint House/Senate
committee
amended their "intelligence authorization" bills to include a provision
greatly expanding provisions for roving wiretaps.

The provision was not in the original house or senate versions of the
bills submitted to the conference committee; two years earlier, the House
had rejected roving wiretaps.

Under the provisions of the bill, you will no longer need to be a
criminal suspect to be wiretapped -- you won't even need to know the
suspect! If the suspect visits your home or business, any communications
device there will be subject to wiretapping too, even if the suspect does
not intend to use it.

When the bill left the committee, it was no longer subject to amendment,
and could only be accepted or rejected. Both houses passed the bill, and
it is awaiting Clinton's signature.

Is this what they've been doing behind closed doors while giving us the
Lewinsky circus?


33 responses total.

 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 1 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Mon, Nov  9, 1998 (20:44) * 3 lines 
 
hell, they're just making what they've been doing legal is all, maybe not
constitutionally correct, but now they can't lose a litigation for illegally
wire-tapping your phone! i know my phone lines at work are monitored....


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 2 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Sun, Nov 15, 1998 (16:19) * 1 lines 
 
I fail to see the problem. I don't have conversations about illegal activities. They can tap my phone anytime they want with my blessings. MY only request is that they also trace my calls and let me have access to the information. I'd love to get my hands on those telemarketers.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 3 of 33: Ray Lopez (ratthing) * Sun, Nov 15, 1998 (21:23) * 4 lines 
 

fine for you but not for me. i dont have convos about illegal activities
either, but it is too easy now for someone to claim that i do.



 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 4 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Sun, Nov 15, 1998 (21:37) * 3 lines 
 
yeah, what's that called? where they take bits of your conversation and fuse it back together?

i don't talk about anything either....oh well, guess we knew this was next.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 5 of 33: Riette Walton  (riette) * Mon, Nov 16, 1998 (04:45) * 1 lines 
 
the promised land...


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 6 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Mon, Nov 16, 1998 (08:28) * 1 lines 
 
I think you are paranoid. yes they can do what you are saying, but they always could. Question is: Why would they?


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 7 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Mon, Nov 16, 1998 (09:12) * 3 lines 
 
who're you talking to, tim? (re: paranoid)

why do they do it? got me....


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 8 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Mon, Nov 16, 1998 (21:45) * 1 lines 
 
I was talking to Ray. Sorry, I should have addressed it to Him. I was asking why they would patch together a conversation from a wiretap. There are easier ways to frame someone.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 9 of 33: Ray Lopez (ratthing) * Tue, Nov 17, 1998 (09:32) * 3 lines 
 

the more important question is, "why wouldn't they?"



 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 10 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Tue, Nov 17, 1998 (09:58) * 2 lines 
 
they'd have no fun with the stuff i talk about, rather blah to say the least!



 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 11 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Tue, Nov 17, 1998 (13:00) * 1 lines 
 
I don't think it really matters. I know how wiretaps work, and how bugs work. If they want to waste the time and effort, let"em.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 12 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Tue, Nov 17, 1998 (20:47) * 2 lines 
 
boy, aren't you a little jack of all trades *grin* so, what is your line of work,
oh mighty tim?


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 13 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Tue, Nov 17, 1998 (22:13) * 1 lines 
 
I drive heavy trucks, local and shorthaul.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 14 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Wed, Nov 18, 1998 (10:25) * 1 lines 
 
and you moonlight as a 007, right? *heehee*


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 15 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Wed, Nov 18, 1998 (16:43) * 1 lines 
 
NO! But, I've been trained in physical security by our favorite uncle. Detecting wiretaps and bugs was part of my job.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 16 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Wed, Nov 18, 1998 (19:32) * 1 lines 
 
i thought as much! which branch?


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 17 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Wed, Nov 18, 1998 (19:59) * 1 lines 
 
Army. They also taught me to read write and speak russian.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 18 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Wed, Nov 18, 1998 (20:02) * 1 lines 
 
linguistics, eh? that's one of the toughest schools to go to for the military, so i hear...


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 19 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Wed, Nov 18, 1998 (21:49) * 6 lines 
 
95% of the applicants fail the qualification test. 25% fail to get a security clearance before the class starts. My class started with 280 students, 35 graduated. In a one year course, you earn 90 college credit hours. This is the way the course is figured: 8 hours instruction, 8 hours study, 8hours sleep, 5 days a week. Every week you are tested. You have to maintain a 90% or better, across the board, or you fail. No second chance. By the 6th week, you are not allowed to speak english in the classroom. B
the 12th week you are not allowed
to speak english anywhere on the school premises. By the 18th week you are not allowed to speak english during duty hours, no matter where you are.
This is comical because the cadre can't speak anything but english. By the 18th
week the cadre has to use interpreters to talk to students.
Cadre is your company commander, first sargeant, platoon sargeant, etc.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 20 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Thu, Nov 19, 1998 (07:47) * 1 lines 
 
gotcha. i knew someone who failed out of linguistics (russian) for the air force.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 21 of 33: Ray Lopez (ratthing) * Thu, Nov 19, 1998 (08:33) * 9 lines 
 

one of the smartest guys i know is a retired USAF colonel who once
worked as a russian expert for the Air Intelligence Agency. i took
russian in college but this guy was really good.

are you retired army, tim? i work as a contractor for the Army
MEDCOM right now. i grew up in a military family and really like
working with military folks and retirees.



 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 22 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Thu, Nov 19, 1998 (13:17) * 1 lines 
 
I am ex-army, not retired. I was in 6 years.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 23 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Thu, Nov 19, 1998 (17:43) * 1 lines 
 
and have you been a truck driver ever since?


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 24 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (04:01) * 2 lines 
 
No, I started negotiating oil leases, lasted two years, went bust. Then, I worked as a cabinetmaker, for a year. Then worked in a foundry for 2 years.
Worked industrial construction for 1 year. Then became a truck driver, for the last nearly 9 years


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 25 of 33: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (09:20) * 2 lines 
 
Have you worked on drilling rigs?



 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 26 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (10:06) * 3 lines 
 
All I did was: pick out a property, negotiate a lease, and then, either sell the lease, or persuade a wildcatter to drill. At one point I bought a wheat farm, 640 acres, a full section, because all the mineral rights went with it. There was no oil on the place, but I did a few things to make people think there was, and sold the place for 3 times what it was worth as a farm. Don't get
me wrong, I never, at any time, told anyone, that oil was present. I just kept my mouth shut and acted like there was oil present. It worked, hook, line, and
sinker.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 27 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (11:12) * 1 lines 
 
oh, you're a con artist!


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 28 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (13:19) * 7 lines 
 
Not anymore than any salesman trying to sell something is. What I basically did
was to form a company on the side. an exploration company. Then I filed a lease
with that company leasing oil rights, with myself, as property owner, getting
a large cash settlement and a large percentage of the royalties. I then hired a wildcatter from out of state to make a show of drilling. all this while the
property was on the market. After the drilling started, I had five offers within
three days all insisting on transfer of 100% of mineral rights. I never told
anybody there was any oil on the land.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 29 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (13:27) * 3 lines 
 
I had the land listed at a fair price for farm land with me retaining mineral
rights. It was a fact that I had to sell the land within a short time because I
needed the money and all involved knew this. Everyone bidding on the land wanted the mineral rights. I really wanted to keep the mineral rights. But I knew that I would never sell the land without the mineral rights in a short time. So I just upped the ante by doing what I did.


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 30 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (17:45) * 1 lines 
 
what in the hell are mineral rights? no oil, but lots of minerals?


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 31 of 33: Tim Guenther  (TIM) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (17:45) * 3 lines 
 
Mineral rights are the ownership of everything below the ground, including oil,
that is there naturally.



 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 32 of 33: Wolf  (wolf) * Fri, Nov 20, 1998 (17:45) * 2 lines 
 
never heard of owning everything below the ground. what if i owned everything
above ground? where would it end?


 Topic 22 of 96 [news]: roving wiretaps bill passes .. buh bye privacy
 Response 33 of 33: Paul Terry Walhus (terry) * Sat, Nov 21, 1998 (21:53) * 2 lines 
 
Hey, I'm setting up a drilling rig out at my place in the country. Heh!


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